brundel ETA 2 weeks for Vector? When will writeup be posted?
2 weeks on the release man, brundel I’m sure can fill you in on the write upbrundel ETA 2 weeks for Vector? When will writeup be posted?
In the next few days I'll let out one of the ingredients with a breakdown of its chemical constituents, why the ingredient was used etc. I mean obviously because its anabolic but how often do we see a product labeled as an anabolic or a gda etc but it has random ingredients that have no point in the product. Fillers and bs. So I'll explain why it's there.brundel ETA 2 weeks for Vector? When will writeup be posted?
So far we havnt seen any negative impact on hpta. If anything it seems to be giving it a kick.Any thoughts on how this would be during PCT after a SARMs cycle? Alongside or after SERM?
In the next few days I'll let out one of the ingredients with a breakdown of its chemical constituents, why the ingredient was used etc. I mean obviously because its anabolic but how often do we see a product labeled as an anabolic or a gda etc but it has random ingredients that have no point in the product. Fillers and bs. So I'll explain why it's there.
This first one you might have heard of but I've never seen it used at this level.
For example It's one thing to use 200mg of a 10:1 extract. And another to use 1000mg of a 100:1. 50x stronger. So even if you have heard of the plant you for sure have never had access to some thing like this.
And again this is just 1 of 3.
Vector is going to be major.
This does skew the results some for me. Even fully saturated, you obviously make better gains while taking creatine, so figuring out which of the two is doing what, will be a guess.He has been using creatine, 5 grams daily for the past 3-4 months so fully saturated.
sorry but thats nonsense. You wont make significant better gains with creatine. Yes, you get a little stronger after beginning to use it but if you are saturated, the effect stays the same. if you cut it out, you will maybe loose a little bit of your strength but thats it. creatine is effective, yes absolutely, but it seems that you are WAY overestimating it’s effectiveness.This does skew the results some for me. Even fully saturated, you obviously make better gains while taking creatine, so figuring out which of the two is doing what, will be a guess.
Curious to see what you've got here.In the next few days I'll let out one of the ingredients with a breakdown of its chemical constituents, why the ingredient was used etc. I mean obviously because its anabolic but how often do we see a product labeled as an anabolic or a gda etc but it has random ingredients that have no point in the product. Fillers and bs. So I'll explain why it's there.
This first one you might have heard of but I've never seen it used at this level.
For example It's one thing to use 200mg of a 10:1 extract. And another to use 1000mg of a 100:1. 50x stronger. So even if you have heard of the plant you for sure have never had access to some thing like this.
And again this is just 1 of 3.
Vector is going to be major.
I'm gonna try to get ingredient 1 breakdown out by tomorrow.Curious to see what you've got here.
I think this was misinterpreted. If he had never taken Creatine and started at the same time he could expect some extra gains in size.This does skew the results some for me. Even fully saturated, you obviously make better gains while taking creatine, so figuring out which of the two is doing what, will be a guess.
Them pipes went from guns to cannons!brundel
Update:
I just noticed this stuff puts me in a good mood almost all the time!
Hell if it didnt do anything else I would take it just for the good mood!
almost up 10lbs.
View attachment 159365
Starting pic
View attachment 159366
And the lighting was a little better for some reason on the starting pics. I try to stand in the same place. the distance is an issue as well.Them pipes went from guns to cannons!
Yeah your arms and upper pecs/anterior delts got massiveAnd the lighting was a little better for some reason on the starting pics. I try to stand in the same place. the distance is an issue as well.
should have put markers on the floor where to stand. lol
Amazing results!! This stuff is the real deal!!And the lighting was a little better for some reason on the starting pics. I try to stand in the same place. the distance is an issue as well.
should have put markers on the floor where to stand. lol
HahaFeel like a 1st grader ready for story time.
I don't think so my man. There is no possible way to quantify extra gains. So if youve already been on testosterone, creatine, etc. for awhile, then they are no longer doing anything?? Thats funny, then why take them? If you are familiar with the way appropriate studies are conducted, then you would understand why creatine can skew the results. If creatine wasn't doing anything, then he wouldn't have any problems discontinuing creatine ahead of Vector, so as not to skew the results. Scientifically, his results will essentially be unquantifiable, or worthless imo.I think this was misinterpreted. If he had never taken Creatine and started at the same time he could expect some extra gains in size.
I have been using 5g of creatine a day for so long I can't even guess.
I have gained 9.5 lbs. in 43 days. my waist size is the same.
Note: I work pretty hard in the gym but I almost always have. Trust me I can't gain like this naturally with a perfect diet in 6 months.
I think the point he is trying to make is that after being on creatine for sometime, the initial weight, size, and strength gains have subsided and are kind of "set," if you will. In a clinical setting, yes that skews results, but with that mindset, and log ANYone does on here should not matter if the testers aren't on the same weight program, and same exact diets. But I think we can say, if a person is fully saturated with creatine for 5 or 6 months, and is gaining at a steady rate monthly , then those gains jump tremendously upon starting Vector, then if the only variable changed is adding Vector to the routine, then we can attribute those to the added supplement.I don't think so my man. There is no possible way to quantify extra gains. So if youve already been on testosterone, creatine, etc. for awhile, then they are no longer doing anything?? Thats funny, then why take them? If you are familiar with the way appropriate studies are conducted, then you would understand why creatine can skew the results. If creatine wasn't doing anything, then he wouldn't have any problems discontinuing creatine ahead of Vector, so as not to skew the results. Scientifically, his results will essentially be unquantifiable, or worthless imo.
That will skew the results in a clinical or non clinical setting. The only difference is that some on here won't mind. I prefer to refer to studies and logs where one can accurately gauge results. In this case, there will be no quantifiable results. One may "try" and quantify results, but this is no more than guessing. Like I said, if the creatine is no longer helping with gains, then discontinue it and do a proper study imo.I think the point he is trying to make is that after being on creatine for sometime, the initial weight, size, and strength gains have subsided and are kind of "set," if you will. In a clinical setting, yes that skews results, but with that mindset, and log ANYone does on here should not matter if the testers aren't on the same weight program, and same exact diets. But I think we can say, if a person is fully saturated with creatine for 5 or 6 months, and is gaining at a steady rate monthly , then those gains jump tremendously upon starting Vector, then if the only variable changed is adding Vector to the routine, then we can attribute those to the added supplement.
I mean this with all due respect and not trying to start a fight here, but why are you interested in the product at all then. One of the testers has already said he is taken creatine as well. So based off your thoughts, his 9lbs gained is skewed. The only way for you to know for sure is to purchase yourself and discontinue ALL other supplements and run it and let us know the resultsThat will skew the results in a clinical or non clinical setting. The only difference is that some on here won't mind. I prefer to refer to studies and logs where one can accurately gauge results. In this case, there will be no quantifiable results. One may "try" and quantify results, but this is no more than guessing. Like I said, if the creatine is no longer helping with gains, then discontinue it and do a proper study imo.
Then don't use the product. You don't have many friends do you?I don't think so my man. There is no possible way to quantify extra gains. So if youve already been on testosterone, creatine, etc. for awhile, then they are no longer doing anything?? Thats funny, then why take them? If you are familiar with the way appropriate studies are conducted, then you would understand why creatine can skew the results. If creatine wasn't doing anything, then he wouldn't have any problems discontinuing creatine ahead of Vector, so as not to skew the results. Scientifically, his results will essentially be unquantifiable, or worthless imo.
Be realistic. What you are asking for is done during multi million dollar drug approvals, not small supplement companies. The closest thing to what you’re asking for is done by Muscletech. How do you feel about those results? In the supplement world, any biostatistician would absolutely rip every single “supplement test” to shreds. However, I don’t disagree with you completely. In fact, I turned down the opportunity to test Vector because I had recently started a FD 2.0/Viron/Exotherm run and felt that I wouldn’t be able to honestly give feedback on what Vector since I hadn’t been on those together in years. That being said, a middle aged 200lb+ experienced lifter who has been on specific supplements for an extended period of time, and has experienced little or no changes for a while, does not need to discontinue creatine to give us a decent idea of what a product is doing. I’m looking forward to trying it myself, maybe you will too.That will skew the results in a clinical or non clinical setting. The only difference is that some on here won't mind. I prefer to refer to studies and logs where one can accurately gauge results. In this case, there will be no quantifiable results. One may "try" and quantify results, but this is no more than guessing. Like I said, if the creatine is no longer helping with gains, then discontinue it and do a proper study imo.
Well said.I think the point he is trying to make is that after being on creatine for sometime, the initial weight, size, and strength gains have subsided and are kind of "set," if you will. In a clinical setting, yes that skews results, but with that mindset, and log ANYone does on here should not matter if the testers aren't on the same weight program, and same exact diets. But I think we can say, if a person is fully saturated with creatine for 5 or 6 months, and is gaining at a steady rate monthly , then those gains jump tremendously upon starting Vector, then if the only variable changed is adding Vector to the routine, then we can attribute those to the added supplement.
Middle aged! bless your heart. LOLBe realistic. What you are asking for is done during multi million dollar drug approvals, not small supplement companies. The closest thing to what you’re asking for is done by Muscletech. How do you feel about those results? In the supplement world, any biostatistician would absolutely rip every single “supplement test” to shreds. However, I don’t disagree with you completely. In fact, I turned down the opportunity to test Vector because I had recently started a FD 2.0/Viron/Exotherm run and felt that I wouldn’t be able to honestly give feedback on what Vector since I hadn’t been on those together in years. That being said, a middle aged 200lb+ experienced lifter who has been on specific supplements for an extended period of time, and has experienced little or no changes for a while, does not need to discontinue creatine to give us a decent idea of what a product is doing. I’m looking forward to trying it myself, maybe you will too.
WaitingI'm gonna try to get ingredient 1 breakdown out by tomorrow.
So insult someone because you don't understand how this works? Now YOU sound like someone with no friends.Then don't use the product. You don't have many friends do you?
And I mean this with all due respect. Since when does advocating for him to drop the creatine for quantifiable results mean I shouldn't be interested in the product? No offense, but that makes no sense. Also, its not my "thoughts" that the results would be skewed, its a fact. I learned how to design studies in college..these are not just "thoughts". I do however agree with you in that you are apparently right..the only way to find out if this works, is to do it myself. Just trying to help, and I'm shocked at all the hate here....its rediculous. :-(I mean this with all due respect and not trying to start a fight here, but why are you interested in the product at all then. One of the testers has already said he is taken creatine as well. So based off your thoughts, his 9lbs gained is skewed. The only way for you to know for sure is to purchase yourself and discontinue ALL other supplements and run it and let us know the results
I'm for sure not attacking you. Hopefully you don't see it this way.Ok, you know what? I was actually interested in the product, and that's why im curious to see what it can do. Everyone attacking my for having higher standards and understanding what it takes to design a study, is really just showing me who you are and what you know. In no way am I attacking Vector or it's possible results, so no need to attack me! I hope you realize that in doing so, you are only doing a disservice to the product and potential buyers. If you are really going to argue that discontinuing creatine would not allow for MUCH better quantification of the results, then you need to go back to school(not meant as an insult).
I also think wait until you see what it is to form an opinionAnd I mean this with all due respect. Since when does advocating for him to drop the creatine for quantifiable results mean I shouldn't be interested in the product? No offense, but that makes no sense. Also, its not my "thoughts" that the results would be skewed, its a fact. I learned how to design studies in college..these are not just "thoughts". I do however agree with you in that you are apparently right..the only way to find out if this works, is to do it myself. Just trying to help, and I'm shocked at all the hate here....its rediculous. :-(
I can’t wait for the release I’m really intrigued. And this post and hype was really the icing on the cake for me. Hopefully have it to run March-June possibly July based on how my body reacts and what results I receiveMy 2 cents. Guys correct about skewing of info. But in reality unless you eat the same exact meals and train the exact same routine at the exact times of days for four weeks and then run the same thing with the addition of the product you’re gonna get a skewed analysis. It’s just not possible to control every variable. As far as creatine. Mike was correct on skewing the data when starting both the product and the creatine at the same time. But when on something for x amount of time what you have done after the initial loading phase is create a baseline. From that baseline you add the new product and compare contrast results accordingly. That’s how everyone of possible should be running their logs, in said analytic fashion.
That being said I can’t wait to either log this for blr or if God’s willing to provide me with extra income by the release so I can run an unsponsored log. I need to be like Studhorse. That change is scary good.
That would be great haha, but I'm not asking for a million dollar study. I only suggested dropping the creatine for quantifiable results and a more accurate portrayal of Vectors effects. Nonetheless, I have had success with other blr products and am still interested in trying this myself.Be realistic. What you are asking for is done during multi million dollar drug approvals, not small supplement companies. The closest thing to what you’re asking for is done by Muscletech. How do you feel about those results? In the supplement world, any biostatistician would absolutely rip every single “supplement test” to shreds. However, I don’t disagree with you completely. In fact, I turned down the opportunity to test Vector because I had recently started a FD 2.0/Viron/Exotherm run and felt that I wouldn’t be able to honestly give feedback on what Vector since I hadn’t been on those together in years. That being said, a middle aged 200lb+ experienced lifter who has been on specific supplements for an extended period of time, and has experienced little or no changes for a while, does not need to discontinue creatine to give us a decent idea of what a product is doing. I’m looking forward to trying it myself, maybe you will too.
From what I've seen so far I don't suspect anyone will be disappointed with this stuff.That would be great haha, but I'm not asking for a million dollar study. I only suggested dropping the creatine for quantifiable results and a more accurate portrayal of Vectors effects. Nonetheless, I have had success with other blr products and am still interested in trying this myself.
No worries, I don't feel like you are attacking me. I appreciate your intelligent discussion, without resorting to insults . Clinical double blind study or not, im still adamant that dropping the creatine before the Vector would be a big help in clarifying the results. His anecdotal evidence would be based only on one variable. The creatine just muddies his experience. I do have high hopes for this though and will likely try it myself. I do appreciate your hard work and innovation on these things...and the civil discussion.I'm for sure not attacking you. Hopefully you don't see it this way.
My point and I think the confusion here lies in one specific distinction.
Your taking anecdotal evidence in the form of one man's experience and trying to somehow compare it to a clinical trial. Which it's not.
It's just 1 experience. Creatine or not.
Now, if we were claiming this was a double blind clinical trial then yea it would be questionable if the subjects were taking creatine. But it's not that and you can't directly compare. It's like comparing apples to a chicken salad. Just 2 completely different things.
I like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches made with extra crunchy peanut butter.Please, can we move on? The last couple of pages have been mind nummingly hard to read. When someone doesn’t understand the basics of something that’s been out for over 20 years, it’s time to move on.
I also like adding heavy whipping cream to my protein shakes to make them more calorie dense as well as creamier which makes them tastier!I like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches made with extra crunchy peanut butter.
You barbarian.I like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches made with extra crunchy peanut butter.
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